Sorry, John K, this is the 3rd of my replies to you within 2 hours. (It menas not only that I post too much...) I adjust the 'organization' as "vs" system, (Maybe unorthodox according to the nonexistent RR-glossary) - System is the model, cut to function AND/or structure, within the boundaries of its usefulness (purpose). I consider organization something similar, but NOT squeezed within boundaries, allowing effects from far and beyond, like a natural system, or a maximum model. It is my personal usage, the only support for it was the silence of this list when I asked concerning questions many times. I don't think it is contradictory to your position (cf: rabbit, as org or syst). * (The below erased 'genom' discussion gave me the idea that we know much more about it than I ever imagined. I think we don't, so whatever we write about genom-intrinsics is consistent with our own sci-fi about life.) Cheerz John M ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Kineman" <***> To: <***> Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 11:28 AM Subject: Re: Models and ecosystem balance/change...
Everyone, I'm wondering if "organizationi" isn't too vague a concept to allow a discussion of its entailments. What do we mean by organization? The way something is put together, or the purpose for which it is put together? Also, there are many ways to describe how and why something is organized. It seems to me that any concept of organization is dependent on some other system for which or in which it serves a function or purpose. Then the function or purpose in that larger system defines the "organization" for that relationship, and there may be multiple super-systems in which there are various functions and thus various ways of understanding the organization. So, I'm thinking that organization should not be thought of in terms of our mechanical notions of, say "how something is put together" but in purely relational terms, in which case the relationship must be specified before imagining the organization.
For example, the organization of a rabbit is certainly related to its property of life. But that organization is actually a relationship to many larger systems. The system of rabbit evolution and phylogeny through time. Its present-day ecology. Perhaps to a much broader "rabbit consciousness" if there is such a thing, and all of life on Earth. The rabbit is "organized" within all these contexts and I think they are necessary to any description of the organization of the rabbit, given that we are not just talking about the placement of parts. So I'm thinking that organization really has a lot to do with the notion of function. Does this make sense?
John